2008.05.13
Our guest today is Ondi Timoner writer / director of the critically acclaimed doc DiG. Ondi’s most recent film, Join US is an intimate look at cults and mind control. Over the course of the discussion Ondi was very candid about the distribution of both her films and how the landscape for Docs has changed in the four years since DiG was acquired at Sundance.
http://workbookproject.com/?p=5812008.03.14
JOIN US Blog – Ondi – 3/13/08
I am so glad we were finally able to add the deleted scenes. When we were editing the film, Tim and I struggled with how to incorporate the comments of Dr. Robert J Lifton, about how mind control techniques he identified in the brainwashing of American POW’s in China, in the 50’s, were at play today with the War on Terror. I was inspired to start making the film when George W. Bush won re- election in 2004, because I was sure that some form of mind control w...
JOIN US Blog – Ondi – 3/13/08
I am so glad we were finally able to add the deleted scenes. When we were editing the film, Tim and I struggled with how to incorporate the comments of Dr. Robert J Lifton, about how mind control techniques he identified in the brainwashing of American POW’s in China, in the 50’s, were at play today with the War on Terror. I was inspired to start making the film when George W. Bush won re- election in 2004, because I was sure that some form of mind control was at play in America. How could people vote back into office a man who had ruined the economy and lied to them about the justification of a war that was taking the lives of thousands of Iraqis, Americans while destroying our international reputation? I set out to find out why.
I followed the muse of where my camera led me and met these four families at Wellspring Retreat, a cult rehab center one night in April 2005. I was fascinated by discovering that cults in America look totally innocuous, and that a lot of these little churches and self-help groups around the nation are totally unregulated and can veer into dangerous territory when led by charismatic con men and women. But it wasn’t until I met Dr. Lifton and spent time with him and the other experts on mind control, that my question of how Bush got reelected was answered. The answer was: Fear. The techniques of mind control outlined in the Mind Control section of our site are all at play right now in America. The very notion of the War on Terror is an apocalyptic war without any end in sight, against an enemy that cannot be identified. It is ubiquitous. The government can therefore play the fear card whenever they determine that we need to be distracted or controlled. For example, Code Orange, Code Red – This is loaded language that has come to mean the threat of terrorism has risen. Do as we say as your lives are at risk! At that point, we stop questioning and we do as we are told.
We couldn’t find a place to put this in our film without seeming pedantic. But, I can tell it how I see it in a blog! JOIN US explores the individual’s need for a program to live by with a higher purpose, and the innate susceptibility, we all have, to being taken advantage of through mind control techniques as a result of this universal need. The story centers on these four families and their pastor/cult leader. But it really is a microcosm, which can be viewed as an insight into how Saudi and Egyptian terrorists were programmed to fly airplanes into the World Trade Center on 9/11. I recently filmed all aspects of Basic Training for the U.S. Army. That experience showed me how important government sanctioned mind control is in the formation of soldiers. Why would a thinking individual run into enemy fire and sacrifice their own precious life for a war that is unjustified? They wouldn’t. So we need to brainwash them by breaking them down and then building them into soldiers. This is how it works.
It is now March of 2008. The War in Iraq is now the new Vietnam. We are in a recession. We continue to destroy the environment and bring about our own demise through the privileging of industry and private interests over conservation of vital, irreplaceable resources. My deepest hope is that Hillary Clinton and Barak Obama will get behind closed doors, with the leaders of the Democratic Party, decide to stop fighting each other and team up on a ticket of change - before it is too late for all of us. The opposition, heir to George Bush's reign, has vowed to "stay the course" in Iraq, continue tax cuts for the wealthiest Americans, as our economy tanks. John McCain is laying in wait, while two eminently quaified leaders, who would change the direction of our country tear each other down. We’ve got think strategically as they have done so well - controlling us to the point of blindness for years through fear.
I’ve got to go pack. I’m off to shoot a fundraising piece to build more schools in Ethiopia. The problems of the world seem overwhelming, but it feels better to do something – anything - then to sit and watch the news nightly and sleep through it. If we all just do something to help, wherever our lives lead us – even if its right out our back doors - we can change lives – one at a time. My mom taught me that every Saturday when she made me get out of bed at 6AM and go feed the homeless.
2008.01.15
Hello to all visitors of this site. Welcome. We are so excited to launch joinusthemovie.com as a resource for anyone and everyone touched by mind control of any kind, and as a springboard for dialogue on this massive and all-too-often-ignored problem in our world.
In America alone there are well over 5000 documented cults, and more and more all the time. I discovered the subconscious pre-conceived notions I myself had when I started filming JOIN US in April of 2005: I didn’t know what I...
Hello to all visitors of this site. Welcome. We are so excited to launch joinusthemovie.com as a resource for anyone and everyone touched by mind control of any kind, and as a springboard for dialogue on this massive and all-too-often-ignored problem in our world.
In America alone there are well over 5000 documented cults, and more and more all the time. I discovered the subconscious pre-conceived notions I myself had when I started filming JOIN US in April of 2005: I didn’t know what I expected to see pull into Wellspring Retreat, the live-in cult rehabilitation center, that first night – but when “normal” looking people in nice cars that looked and acted like me and my friends arrived – I realized that I expected shaved heads, uniforms, poverty, ignorance, all those images I had seen in the media as “cults.” That was when I realized how important this film was going to be to follow through in completing and getting out there to people. This problem of slipping under someone else’s control is way more insidious and common then we know. There are between 10-15 million cult members in America, and millions more around the world. They are very often highly intelligent people, seekers in life to find the deeper meaning or be the best they can be, or to contribute in some way. And they don’t sign up for the abuse that later ensues. They usually have an incredibly rewarding experience in the beginning, which only later and gradually turns into exploitation of their minds, bodies, children, etc.
The film JOIN US is the most difficult film I have made to date. Maybe I say that because it’s the most recent so the struggle is fresh in my mind, but I don’t think so... As a young mother with a 1 1/2 year old baby on my hip when I started shooting, the subject matter - which often centered around the abuse the children endured in the group - was difficult for me to bear. Similarly, watching the mothers’ trying to plow through the confusion and guilt they were feeling to begin to trust their own instincts as mothers again was extremely emotional for me. And as a mother myself, it was the first film I made where I balanced Joaquim and the 18-hour production days on the road. The biggest challenge for me came in post-production though. Even though there were only 300 hours of footage, as compared to 2000 hours with DIG!, balancing of the information on this important topic that I felt dedicated to imparting and the emotion/drama of the unfolding story of these four families and their cult leaders over two years was like walking a tightrope for me and my fantastic partner in editing, Tim Rush. The two of us were so deep in it at points we couldn’t see clearly any longer and would have test screenings at my house regularly to gain perspective. We got through it though and are proud and grateful to share this movie with you.
I’m going to write out answers to the questions I have been asked the most about JOIN US. If there’s anything more I can add, please take a bite out of the “Ask Ondi” apple, and I’ll get back to you as soon as I can. Please share your story with us on the “Share Your Story” apple. Thank you again for your interest in JOIN US.
Why JOIN US after DIG!
I became interested in group dynamics and the sacrifices we all gradually make to belong, over the seven years I spent with The Brian Jonestown Massacre and The Dandy Warhols filming and editing DIG! Then, in 2004, as I followed the news and observed the results of the recent elections, the subject of potential mind control in group dynamics took on broader and darker implications. Seemingly diabolical but perhaps brilliant campaigns caused large voting blocs, often drawn across religious lines, to cast their ballots against their own best interests on many issues. Why did so many people seem to lose sight of the facts? Was this mind control at work on a national level? The combination of these things lit my fire to find out what was really going on in America. Post 9/11, the population of religious organizations had reached an all time high. I thought that perhaps in these times, people are anxious to find someone to follow, a group identity and a program to live by, and are willing to turn in the imperative to question at the door.
We contacted cult experts and centers of study and treatment of brainwashing to try and find a way into a story we could follow over time. Time, to me, provides the greatest narrative. What I do is driven by following the serendipity of people’s lives as they unfold, and then uncovering the real beats to the story in the editing process. Every person’s life story is ultimately fascinating for one reason or another, (it’s all in the story telling), and in this case we were lucky enough to find a group of people who were just beginning the process of awakening from the spell they’d been under and who allowed us to dive deep into their hearts and minds.
Wellspring Retreat, the only accredited cult treatment center in the world, has a two-week, live-in program which essentially de-programs people emerging from destructive groups. Their recidivism rate is less than 1%. Wellspring’s program is based on the studies of Dr. Robert J. Lifton, an Air Force psychiatrist who studied prisoners of war in China in the 50’s and uncovered 8 techniques of mind control. If 6 of the 8 techniques are active in a group, it is considered destructive and defined as a cult. Liz Shaw and Dr. Paul Martin ran the program at the time. Liz called us one day in April, 2005 and told us that four families were leaving a church in South Carolina they believed could be a cult and were expected to arrive at Wellspring in the next two days. She said they were willing to be filmed. We threw our credit cards down and fly out there to meet these families.
Our first days of shooting were easily 20 hours long. I was shocked by the level of intimacy we reached almost instantly with people who had clearly felt duped and misled when they had trusted before. The hardest challenge the families were facing was overcoming their guilt and confusion for having let their children be brutally beaten so they would make it to heaven. It was this challenge that quickly made us realize that the children and the effect of this group on the children, would be a large focus of this film. We were at Wellspring for Mother’s Day, ironically, and as I was a new mother myself, with my then two year old son in tow, the tales of child abuse hit me especially hard. I could not conceive of how this treatment center could ever get the mothers of the group to trust their maternal instincts again after having been the instrument of the Pastor in beating their own children mercilessly. I knew that every cell in my body was programmed to protect my child at all costs. How had they been convinced to let this happen to their children?
Ultimately, no matter how resilient children are said to be, we could not believe that the damage done to them at the Mountain Rock Church in South Carolina could ever be undone.
The Story
We never thought we’d be working on this film for two years, but then one never knows what they are getting into with a documentary about something that is active and unfolding. We filmed at the treatment center during those two weeks and again when more people from Mountain Rock Church came for treatment. We followed these families home and continued with them as they tried to find a normal life, to find and trust their own instincts again and to make a solid case against their former Pastor. The legal process was difficult to capture because the Anderson prosecutor and police would only meet with us off camera.
In Anderson, we also spent a lot of time capturing the perspective of the Pastor and his wife, who are fascinating characters. We found a man and woman in them who truly believed in what they had done and were going to continue to do in “healing people through the Book of Acts” and helping people “in both spiritual and natural things.” They felt they had been abandoned by their church family and wronged themselves, even though they had clearly broken major laws and damaged lives along the way. Raimund and Deborah Melz told us that they too had been to Wellspring for treatment but had left part way through the program.
We discovered that the Pastor himself had been abused as a child and therefore believed wholeheartedly in his program of discipline. In fact, he was his own best example since, as he proclaimed, he was as close to perfect as Jesus. He believed he had nothing to fear because “the laws of the land come after God’s laws.”
The Process
In spending extensive hours with both the recovering cult members and the Pastor and his wife, we experienced black and white turning to grey. At the end of the first two weeks we spent at Wellspring Retreat, we felt it was clear that the Pastor and his wife were monsters who had knowingly beaten children, further damaging these people by controlling their lives and exploiting them financially. However, as we spent time with Pastor and Mrs. Melz and more time with the church members themselves, we realized that sometimes people can come to believe that what they’re doing is right, willfully denying the harm they are causing.
This applied to both the cult leaders and their devotees. Our own understanding of personal ownership for one’s own actions was challenged by coming to know and love our subjects. At one point, one of the mothers, Tonya, turned to look at my son, Joaquim and said, “Gosh, he’s so beautiful, he’s the fist child I’ve ever met who hasn’t been beaten.” The cult issue is a very complicated one and even to the end, we struggled to present a film which does not condemn, does not reprimand, that does not hand the audience a clear answer but instead implores the audience to think for themselves. The film is told in two parts as it organically unfolds: A black and white picture of the Pastor is formed in our imaginations as we listen to the stories told about him at the treatment center; in the 2nd half of the picture, we travel to South Carolina and meet the Pastor and his wife, while seeing deeper into the lives of our subjects. We find it harder and harder to judge and hopefully notice the judgment itself.
The editing process was very difficult and lasted over a year and a half. Tim Rush and I edited hundreds of scenes separately, and then jumped onto the same AVID to cut the movie down from well over 12 hours to the 100 minutes it is now. During this time, Vasco and I returned to South Carolina to film with our subjects periodically for a week here and a week there. I wrote the voiceover for Joaquin Sullivan to read in early February ‘07. As with DIG! the addition of voiceover to be delivered by a character in the film was a last minute move and a key component to the efficacy of the finished piece. I like having one of the film’s subjects to tell the story and tie up any loose ends because I fell it doesn’t break the bubble of the world you are exploring. To me, the best films take you on a journey and you don’t get off the ride until it’s over. I chose Joaquin to do the voiceover firstly because he is from California and therefore doesn’t have a southern accent. It was imperative to prevent people from saying to themselves, “Oh, this is a film about a bunch of people from “the Bible belt” … this could never happen to me.” Joaquin was also chosen because he broke up the cult after he was excommunicated from Mountain Rock Church and his wife was made to divorce him. They have since remarried and have had another child. Joaquin is considered to be the “anti-Christ” by the Pastor especially as he pursues Raimond Melz, legally to this day. Joaquin is leading the charge of the ex-members against Raimound in civil court to get the church building back. If they win, they plan to sell the church and give the proceeds to charity.
We shot and edited in phases, hunting and gathering, as I like to do. Our biggest challenge was balancing the intellectual information the piece needed to relay to forge an understanding of the subject matter and its ramifications, with the emotion and aesthetic feeling that is obviously essential to create and protect. It was a delicate dance made more difficult by our familiarity with the material. We lost perspective repeatedly, regained it, went right, left and up and down. Finally, we arrived at the movie you’re watching. We are grateful to everyone who worked tirelessly at Interloper Films and especially to our documentary subjects who bring to this day.
The Budget
Budgeting a film like this is nearly impossible because you never know what’s going to happen next. Before filming, we made attempts to find outside financing and were close to making a deal but it was slow to happen.
Then the call came from Wellspring and we jumped on it. As soon as we got back, we realized that the complicated and delicate nature of this subject matter, which we felt was incredibly rich in substance but still unfolding, could possibly be more effectively told if it was an independently funded project. We had gained the trust of our subjects and felt the responsibility to be at liberty to tell the real story, without having to answer to any political restrictions. We ended up financing the film ourselves, much in the way DIG! was made which though it ups the stakes, gave us a sense of freedom to tell it like it is
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| Ondi talks to Liz Shaw |
Producer Vasco Nunes, Director of Programming Rachel Rosen, and Ondi Timoner at the La Film Festival premiere of JOIN US |
Kristy and Joaquin Sullivan w Baby Kyra, Editor Tim Rush, and Ondi Timoner at JOIN US LAFF premiere |
Tim Rush (editor of JOIN US) and fellow Interlopers Jeff Frey, Ryan Bowles, and Ondi Timoner at JOIN US premiere party |